THE HARD R: GOD FORBID’S DALLAS COYLE ON HOW YOUR ENVIRONMENT AFFECTS YOUR MUSIC

Thursday, April 10th, 2008 at 6:09pm by

The Hard R with God Forbid’s Dallas Coyle

It’s The Environment, Stupid…

What’s up party people? When you do a blog every week you wonder what to talk about and this week I decided to talk about the progression from our first record (Reject The Sickness) to our second record (Determination). I have no idea how familiar any of you may be with those records but I’d figure a look into the inner thinking of how each record was made and how we approached making those records will help any of you aspiring to do music for a living to do it more efficiently than we did.

I believe that people are affected by their environment more so than the other way around. When we were writing Reject The Sickness we were just finding out about the hardcore scene in NJ, which at the time consisted of a lot of types of styles, mosh-core, thug-core, rap-core, emo, tech-core. In NJ, at that time everything was hardcore. There was no metal scene. We were the metal band in NJ at the time. We had a particular incident at Obsessions Night Club that ejected us from playing with bands like Morbid Angel and Testament to playing shows with bands like For The Love Of…, Train Of Thought, E-Town Concrete, Clubber Lang, NJ Bloodline, Candiria, just to name a few. We were all metal heads when we found this new form of aggression in the hardcore scene.

By our peers we were NEVER labeled hardcore but we played so many hardcore shows that people who didn’t know us thought we sounded like Bulldoze and Fury Of Five. I guess that’s guilt by association. We’d play shows with Dillinger at The Plum Street Pub which was a seedy bar which held only 80 people. We first played with Lamb Of God when they were Burn The Priest in Reading, PA at this guy Alex T’s garage. It was a broke ass show. They played in front of us and we played in front of them. I think one person showed up. My point is, in writing Reject The Sickness the environment we were in affected the types of songs we’d written. If you listen to Reject The Sickness, you hear the metal but you also hear the brutal breakdowns, the chaotic arrangements, the dissonant guitars that reeked the scene at the time. Not to say we were copying our peers but the environment we were in influenced the music we wrote and recorded.

When we got the finished copy of Reject The Sickness everyone in the band was stoked because the quality of the recording was just so good at that time in 1999, that we impressed ourselves and our peers. We gained a healthy hardcore following and starting playing those bigger clubs because of that hardcore following we generated. The music on that CD obviously wasn’t typical because only a week after we finished the master Century Media called and said they wanted to sign us. This is the point where the direction of the band changed. Our environment had changed.

In earlier blogs I talked about resentment in our scene toward us that made us say ‘fuck you’ to a lot of the people who were hating. At the time we were signing with CM we knew we were writing a record for a ‘metal’ label so the band decided clearly that the next record had to be the most METAL SHIT EVER!. That’s where you end up with Determination in 2001. Our environment influenced our song writing because now our environment was Century Media. We were proud. We were metal. We were viable. We were represented by Century Media.

The music didn’t change much but what do we see? Determination had more melody, more solos, more thrash. A lot of the brutality in the music from RTS was toned down because we had fights at all of our shows because RTS was just a brutal album. We wanted to get away from that. So songs like “Broken Promise” and “Divide My Destiny” were created due to the environment of Century Media being metal and God Forbid always being metal. We also wanted to distance ourselves from the violence in the hardcore scene at the time. But in the NJ scene, we were the metal band in the hardcore scene but the hardcore scene influenced our metal. I know it’s confusing but it does make sense.

After Determination came out we went on tour and lost many of our ‘hardcore’ fans because Determination was more metal; we were bigger; we had toured. And that was our growth, produced by the environment we were put in by being signed to Century Media.

This goes to show you when you are true to yourself in writing your environment is supposed to affect you! Imagine how our environment changed from Determination to Gone Forever. A lot of people may find that interesting…. Maybe we’ll get into that next week.

For now I’m going to give you a song each from each of the albums discussed and you see if you can tell the difference between the songs with the ideas I’ve put forth…

The songs:

The RTS song is “Dark Waters:” One of my favs on that album. This song is straight to the point and brutally honest with no fat. It’s heavy, off time, but still metal with a more ‘hardcore’ sound for the time in 1999.

God Forbid – “Dark Waters” (Reject the Sickness)

The Determination song is “Network.” It’s OK, but you can see us TRYING to be metal by writing longer structures and the song has a little too much fat. We’re trying to have ‘song structure’, hence us trying to show how metal we can be.

God Forbid – “Network” (Determination)

HORNS!!!!

  • http://www.myspace.com/deadspout deadspout

    Great blog entry Dallas. Most people can’t fathom as to why a band would change their sound and you just gave an inside as to why bands change direction and sound. Hopefully those who say, GOD FORBID “sold out!” will read this and associate your story with a possibility that bands they loved to listen to were inspired by their surroundings as well…rather than “selling out”…wher as I am sure there are some exceptions to that mentality in some bands. Fans tend to forget artists are inspired by their surroundings and current events…
    Horns up Dallas, thanks for this entry.

  • http://myspace.com/murderousperfection bloodjunkie

    I totally get what you’re saying. I’m the guitarist in a death metal band called Murderous Perfection and we’re from Puerto Rico. Thing is, Puerto Rico has a totally hardcore dominated scene, so when the death metal/metal shows come around there’s never a lot of people (and if there are their expecting the most brutal shit around). In our songs we have the fast guitars and blast-beats of death metal, but incorporate breakdowns to expand the margin of fans. We can’t please everyone, but the fans that who we are know we always deliver and never dissapoint.

    You can definetly point out the difference in styles in you’re songs, but it doesn’t matter. When the songs are good it doesn’t matter what you’re going for, they’re just good and hopefully people who lend an ear will like them and get the reaction we like to get (Is that the same band?! awesome).
    Great entry!

  • http://stixnstond@yahoo.com Stixnstond in L.A.

    I enjoy these weekly rants Dallas…
    If your a fan of a certain band, a die hard fan you’ll support them in anything they do. Sometimes bands do questionable things (like cameo in a video for a weak lame poser band)… Progression is natural for a band, to grow and not tire their fans and themselves. PANTERA man, theres a good example of progression. Every album they released got heavier and more intense. GF is one of the few new bands i really enjoy. Dallas, you guys write good music, well put together. Alot of the new bands i hear just write songs for the sake of writing songs and their ‘die-hard’ fans buy it… or buy into it, to be more specific. And I’m a fan of METAL – Death, Grind, Sludge, Power (PANTERA POWERMETAL), Hardcore…. and i hate stupid labels like ‘metalcore’… somewhere along the lines someone f*ked up and tried to catagorize everytthing – you’re either a fan Metal or your not – f*K emo too!!

    HORNS UP DALLAS!

  • jesse

    Stixnstond in L.A.

    You’re right. Pantera is a GREAT example of change due to surroundings. No one likes to recognize that though because Pantera doing what they did would be considered “selling out” if it had been a different band, or a different style of music that they changed to/from. God forbid(no pun intended) the great Pantera ever sell out.

    Don’t get me wrong, I fucking love Pantera, and I whole heartedly believe that they are one of the most influential bands of our time. But if a band that went from it’s first two albums being pretty much Glam or Hair Metal, to a complete about-face into the world of actual Heavy Metal because it had a bigger presence and maybe they took a liking to it, shouldn’t that be considered selling out if every other band that people love to hate get the same condemnation for making equally(and sometimes less) drastic changes?

    It just goes to show how hypocritical, and egotistical some metal fans can be. Metal is a solid, and beautiful form of music and expression. You wont find the diversity and challenging technicalities that you find in metal in any other form of music. A true metal fan will embrace diversity and change and accept it for what it is with all factors accounted for, instead of whining and bitching because a band got tired of playing the same old shit they’ve been playing since high school and finally decided to grow up a little bit. Automatically assuming that they did it for anything or anyone but themselves is insanely ignorant. There are definitely exceptions out there, but that doesn’t mean every band does it, especially bands that are obviously somewhat intelligent like God Forbid, and Pantera, who have(had in Pantera’s case) a passion for making music they like to play, and listen to.

    Ignorance is bliss, but it’s a road that goes to nowhere.

  • the_0ne

    woah, you actually played metal in Reading, PA. I’m working there at this moment and live about 10 minutes outside of Reading in West Lawn. I know when I was a young buck, I hit some metal shows around here. Then it got crazy with this rap/hip hop stuff and everything metal is gone. No more t-shirt places anymore. No really good “record” stores. However, the one mall here did put in a Hot Topic, still not the same as the hole-in-the-wall t-shirt shops that they used to have all over the place. :( Man I’m old…

  • Pingback: Way Too Loud! > God Forbid’s Dallas Coyle Talks About The Early Days Of God Forbid

  • http://www.conorschaefer.com/blog/ Conor

    I think you meant “wreaked” instead of “reeked.” But that mistake actually calls to my attention how incredibly eloquent you are for a metalhead. I know that sounds brutally biased, but hey, I love reading your posts, and yeah, I think it’s rare that metalheads get off this kind of fluidity in their expression.

    I’ve studied in Philadelphia and so unfortunately I know the Jersey ‘core scene all too well. I am so, so glad you guys broke out of that. And the garage story is awesome!

    This entry was a bit scatterbrained for my tastes, but you really brought it up by posting the song clips. Thanks for having the balls and the wherewithal to do that. Made your point so, so clear.

    @Stixnstond: Who the hell says “metalcore” isn’t a viable genre?