UNDEROATH THINK YOU SHOULD HAVE THOUGHT ABOUT THE BABY BEFORE YOU HAD SEX
Tuesday, January 12th, 2010 at 11:26am by Axl RosenbergDespite what you may think, I don’t have a problem with Christian metal as long as any religious message isn’t too overt. If you’d never told me that As I Lay Dying and Norma Jean were Christians, I’d have no idea. They don’t let their personal beliefs distract from the music.
But Sergeant D. posted the below Underoath song on Stuff You Will Hate this morning, and… wow. I don’t know Underoath that well and apparently this isn’t really how they sound anymore, so I guess I can give them a pass for how fucking horrible this song is. But the pro-life lyrics – which includes such poetic gems as “Babies die everyday because of a pro-choice made” – really rub me the wrong way. Big time.
You can read all the lyrics over at Stuff You Will Hate. Then come back and tell me why I’m an asshole for being pro-choice, or how politics have no place in metal, or whaaaaa whaaaaa whaaaa.
-AR
Someone needs to sit underoath down and explain to them that god isn’t real, and neo-cons are the enemy.
I love it when someone like you nails it so hard, so early in the comments, that it renders my presence effectively useless.
The benefits of working a job where I’m on the pc all day my friend
i concur on everything
If you think that’s bad;
http://www.myspace.com/fitforakingband
http://www.myspace.com/inthemidstoflions
Just read their bios. Religion in music sucks, no matter which side of the fence it sits on.
FFAK is from my hometown of Tyler. This city has been drinking to koolaid for years. Their bio may seem overboard, but here in East Texas, they are literally preaching to the choir.
I read over the song and was completely disgusted…I know music is supposed to be influenced by and showcase what you’re about, but these guys are a disgrace to both metal and religion. Sounds like someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed, wrote 4 lines he thought were solid and then filled I the rest with rhetoric on those that believe in the figment of a collective imagination would find appealing.
And I’m completely with you on the pro choice bit Axl, I don’t see how anyone should have the right to tell a woman what she can and cannot do with her own body, solely based on a religious argument (especially since the bible has several passages that encourage infanticide). It could be considered ethically wrong to extinguish a potential life, but is it okay to prevent it if it comes out of essentially making the woman a slave? Last time I checked (you pro-life folks) two ‘wrongs’ don’t make a right…
-B
I have a question for everyone who is Pro-choice: why do you feel that you are correct? Who said that a baby is part of a woman’s body and it is her right to choose life or death for the child?
I don’t mean to generalize, but most of you who are Pro-choice probably don’t believe in God, yet you still believe that there are right choices and wrong choices, or in this case, correct opinions and incorrect ones.
If we had evolved from single cell organisms, then there is no moral system, because moral systems have to be created. And if there is no moral system, there definitely is no right-and-wrong. Yet, those of you who are Pro-choice are so passionate that your opinion is correct. Well, if there is no established moral system, then all opinions are correct (or they are all incorrect).
So it seems to me that it is a double standard that you feel that you are correct, when in fact according to your way of thinking Pro-life people are just as correct.
Just a thought.
good job assuming that morality cannot exist in the absence of religion which is patently false
So all pro-choicers always feel passionate about the topic, and are always atheist? Quit generalizing. I feel that I am correct in my pro-choice feelings because people can’t always afford to have kids. Sometimes they wouldn’t be able to take care of it, or maybe the kid would have a severe mental defect. And if you’re going for the “they could just put it up for adoption” angle, remember that a birth in and of itself costs upwards of $10,000. I also believe it should be both the father and the mother’s right to decide on the baby itself; not just the mother.
WTF my comments aren’t popping up
Thank God for that !!
the only things that bother me about this band is the fucking horrendous music they make. you gotta be kidding me with this song. I couldn’t make it past ten seconds listening to this ear raping mess they call music.
the other thing that bothers me is that they stole the title of the song from a famous soundgarden song. morons. Maybe their next song can be called black hole sun.
as far as writing about pro life bullshit. whatever. I don’t agree but I feel musicians can write about whatever their passions are no matter what they are. there are way more liberal viewpoint bands who write songs shitting on bush constantly. Lamb of God, Ministry stand out the most for me.
Their entitled to their conservative beliefs. Otep and System of a Down are two examples of bands that are WAY more preachy and confrontational about their ideals than this.
Don’t even group SoaD with Otep. Otep has no clue about fucking ANYTHING, SoaD is actually educated; also, half of SoaD’s songs are just meaningless, fun, train of thought lyrics.
SOaD gets politically preachy in HALF of their songs, moreso than 95 – 99% of the groups out there.
I don’t see preachy, I’m sorry. I guess the word “preach” doesn’t come to mind when someone is taking about issues that are seriously wrong, instead of trying to control people.
Preach, Tell, Inform, Persuade = Semantics
Preach comes with negative and brainwashing conotations. This isn’t SoaD
They’re entitled to their opinions and can write whatever they write about. If SoaD is preachy, I really don’t mind. Especially because it’s in an artful, tasteful or comedic way.
Underoath is basically saying “Pro-choice is bad. You’re dumb and evil for getting knocked up!”
And in response to those lyrics, “What if you were aborted… you could of never had life”:
So fucking what? I’d be dead and not have any knowledge on what I missed out on. Big loss. At least I wouldn’t have to deal with enduring an Underoath song.
What?? The last past of your statement makes no sense. Also, are you saying you accept outside messages only if they are delivered in an artful or comedic way? That’s cherry-picking the truth.
I have to reply to myself as for some reason there isn’t an option under your comment.
What doesn’t make sense? I was expressing that I would hold no hard feelings if I was aborted and making a quip about not having to listen to Underoath. And funny thing about those lyrics, it should be “you could HAVE never had life.”
No, I don’t particularly care about their messages. I’m just saying they’re there and I don’t mind with SoaD, whereas Underoath crams it down your throat. I don’t really pay attention to those underlying messages either from SoaD. I like SoaD for the fun music and clever lyrics, not really their ideals and morals. I’m not accepting anything as truth or otherwise. You put words in my mouth about what I believe. Blatantly saying a clear message (one that outright berates a very specific group of people) than a band that berates mankind as a whole for things like war and genocide.
I’ll clarify the last statement to the simplest possible way: I would not hold it against my mother if I was aborted. Underoath should stop whining.
Fuck Underoath.
+1 Underoath sucks
Fuck Underoath, they talk about being great Christians preaching forgiveness and whatever else. Then they try to boot their singer when he is struggling with substance abuse (which i can wholly sympathise with), instead of standing by him and offering to help
I know I’ll get flamed but…
http://www.mandm.org.nz/2010/01/contra-mundum-confessions-of-an-anti-choice-fanatic.html
Feticide isn’t homicide because a fetus isn’t a human “being.” It’s about as human as one of your organs. Yes, it has human DNA, yes it is alive, but NO it is not a human being, it is a fragment of a human being. If you have a kidney removed, is it considered murder? What about third trimester abortions? Though pretty developed, they still aren’t human BEINGS. The difference in this case, is that the fetus is PHYSICALLY DEPENDENT on the mother’s vitals, while an infant is SOCIALLY dependent, and can have its needs satisfied by anyone, without causing physical complications. The fetus is a parasite, and it is a privilege, NOT a right, for it to feed off of a woman. Conservatives often either fail to address these facts (like your link did) or they quote mine it.
You didn’t read the whole article, he addressed it.
He addresses it without fully understanding it.
He addresses it without fully understanding it.
He wrote his PhD thesis on it. I think he understands it. You’re the one presenting irrational slogans.
oh geezzz oh geezz….
I cant believe how far ignorance can go….
dude….. oh dude…. I am speechless,….
by that i mean Nate’s comments…
And how is what I said ignorant?
The fetus is not a parasite.
Wow. Care to give some evidence against that?
A fetus is a “parasite”, and yet as soon as it pops out of a woman’s body it’s suddenly a human being with rights? Sorry but I just can’t understand that train of thought. Comparing a fetus with a kidney is ridiculous. I’m not even against abortions, but I can’t agree with what you’re saying here.
You can’t understand that train of thought? You mean you don’t comprehend the transition between physical and social dependance and the fact that, once born, the fetus has entered a completely different stage of life?
Good article. I don’t buy it when people are pro-choice under the guise of protecting woman’s rights — what about the right to live. America is supposed to be about life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Protecting that baby’s right to be born is just as important as protecting a full grown person’s right to live. Abortion is certainly homicide, regardless of what your religious beliefs are.
The baby doesn’t have a right to be born when ITS LIFE IS COMPLETELY DEPENDENT ON THE MOTHER. If it was physically dependent it would have a right to live, but it isn’t, now is it? You fucking twit.
Look man, you’re not going to change my mind. I’m probably not going to change yours either. End of conversation…
Nate,
I’m going to assume you made some typos there, though your last sentence bears intense witness to the emotional attachment you have to the argument, rather than discovering the objective truth.
You claim that the baby/fetus/ doesn’t have a right to life because it is dependent upon the mother for survival. Why not? As addressed in my link, just because someone cannot independently survive without the care of another does not mean that it’s not a human being, and you seem to be alluding to that point without actually saying it. By that logic, people in persistent vegetative states, and other severely mentally or physically disabled persons cease to be human. So, by your logic Che (deftones), lying in a persistent vegetative state in a hospital, isn’t a human, and doesn’t have a right to life. He’s completely dependent upon other people for survival, is he not? So we should save the inconvenience of the people caring for him and pull the plug. After all, he’s not human. But yet, you’ve offered no other explanation for what the requirements of being a human being are. The hunter scenario offered in my link provides reasonable explanation on the basis of appearances alone, which should be enough. If you’re going to appeal to consciousness and brain capability, you have a host of other issues to deal with, all outlined in the article I linked. There are a handful of scenarios in which the termination of a pregnancy becomes a feasible option; rape, complications in a pregnancy which pose serious threat to the mother’s life, to name two. But the vast majority of the time, I hold to the view that abortion is an act of homicide.
As Chris stated, you probably won’t change our minds, we probably won’t change yours. I’m open to hearing your side, if you can make a good case for it. Caps lock and name calling doesn’t give you a very good start. I’m also quite sure that the writer of the article understands the topic, holding a PhD, Masters and Bachelors in different fields. He’s debated this very topic numerous times in public, and to top it off he has as close to firsthand experience as can be. His wife at one time had an abortion.
Cheers.
The difference between vegetative state and fetus is that someone in a vegetative state does not feed off of another human being. Your metaphor is weak, and is designed to make my points look immoral. I’ll get you a link to an article used in my pro-choice paper. It contains an analogy first brought up in the 70’s that holds true today. The analogy I am speaking of starts on the fourth paragraph.
http://spot.colorado.edu/~heathwoo/Phil160,Fall02/thomson.htm
Nate I can’t reply to your comment about the violinist so hopefully you’ll see this one underneath.
Thanks for the polite response this time. Your analogy however does not refute my argument, due to the circumstances surrounding the scenario. You’ll recall I was willing to concede and admitted that a case could be made for abortion on the basis of rape, or circumstances that pose serious health risk to the mother if the pregnancy not carried out normally, so it seems we’re in agreement on those grounds. Would it be “nice” if the woman carried out the pregnancy (when there is no health risk)? Absolutely. Should they be obligated to? Probably not, though I personally hope that they would choose to stick it out.
The rest of the scenario I think doesn’t have much merit. Proposing that pregnancy lasts 9 years is just absurd, and starts to make it look like a biased thought experiment. Pregnancies don’t last that long, so a “what if” scenario doesn’t cut it here, and ends up as speculation.
The fact is the majority of unwanted pregnancies that are terminated are not as a result of rape, or complications that could cause both mother and child to die. These are in the staggering minority (Abortion Supervisory Committee reported numbers as low as 0.5% of all abortions), and so the majority of abortions lack justification other than it being “inconvenient” when the mother consented to the intercourse that conceived in the first place, and the parties did not take the proper precautionary measures to avoid the potential result.
On the subject of my points being designed to make your points look immoral, is because if feticide is homicide, then your points *are* unlawful, and immoral. Perhaps a persistent vegetative state isn’t the best example, but it does put dependence upon another human being, which brings about an inconvenience to the caregiver.
I’ll let you have the last word and then I’m back to work.
Thanks for the debate!
I’ll use your last paragraph as a jumping point. I’d comment on your statistics with counter-statistics or refutations, but I’m really not in the mood, haha. Basically, the difference in types of dependance comes into play here. Social dependance separates human “beings” from things that are just human. Infants and vegetative people are indeed dependent, however, they have a different sort of dependance than fetuses. Anyone (with proper training of course) can operate the tools necessary to keep infants and the vegetative alive. There’s no doubt that killing them would be murder. However, fetuses have a different kind of dependance. They require actual physical parasitism on the host (the mother). I’m pretty certain that you can’t argue that one of the qualities of a human being is most definitely NOT being a parasite. I will definitely concede that the fetus is human, it would be foolish not to. It has human DNA, does it not? What differs is how it functions. Human beings are (generally) an independent species past a certain point. Some human beings are no longer dependent after infancy (in the toddler age). In its most basic form, the fetus differs from a human being. Murder, in a court of law, is defined as the intentional ending of another human being’s life. Why use the phrase “human being” in this definition? Well, it does prove my point, and that’s helpful, but consider the consequences had I NOT used that terminology. Human basically means anything with human DNA — meaning legislature could (technically) be passed that would punish people who removed malignant tumors, malfunctioning organs, and other such afflictions.
Thank you, too, for the debate.
Sorry Nate, I should also clarify that the writer of the article’s wife did *not* at one time have an abortion. My source was incorrect on that, and I just found the correction now. Wanted to clear that up.
If it was physically dependent it would have a right to live, but it isn’t, now is it? You fucking twit.
Your criteria applies to newborns. They are completely dependent on their caregiver, they are not physically dependent of survival so by your argument newborns do not have a right to live. (Which if you’d read the article and the discussion (and if you could reason) you would already know that infanticide is what your argument here entails).
Read the above statement about the types of dependance. Infants require social dependance. They don’t require organic connection the mother. Fetuses are parasites. But of course, go ahead and make bullshit points I’ve already shot down.
If youre not writing about, contributing to- or bringing up Metal. Please shut the fuck up and get off the site.
And why does its dependence on the mother affect its right to live or not? That’s merely your opinion.
Right to live isn’t the issue. The fact that it is physical dependent on the mother means that it’s a parasite. Parasitism is NOT a characteristic of a human being. Ergo, fetuses are not human beings, and as such, abortion is not murder.
See how a proof works ?
If we need to protect a baby’s “right to be born,” don’t we have a legal obligation to prevent miscarriages? Don’t we then have a legal obligation to prosecute every woman who has a miscarriage for involuntary manslaughter?
idiot
How is he an idiot? He’s making a valid point against you stupid neocons. You make all these generalizations and statements and policies without realizing where they lead. If anyone is an idiot it’s you.
You obviously don’t know what involuntary manslaughter is. There are two types:
- Constructive: It occurs when someone kills, without intent, in the course of committing an unlawful act. For example, if a person throws a brick off a bridge into vehicular traffic below they could be found to intend or be reckless as to assault or criminal damage.
- Criminally Negligent: It occurs where death results from serious negligence, or, in some jurisdictions, serious recklessness. Criminally negligent manslaughter occurs where there is an omission to act when there is a duty to do so, or a failure to perform a duty owed, which leads to a death.
I don’t believe a miscarriage would fall into either category, unless it was a direct result of negligence. I don’t know the statistics as far as how many miscarriages are a direct result of negligence, but my mom had a miscarriage and it was completely out of her control.
ITT moronic uneducated, anti-scientific, neocons who believe in blind bullshit fantasy nonsense. If there was any justice in this world they’d be gunned down and ground up into dogfood to make the world a better place!
Do you remember Mortification`s Liberal Mediocrity?? It was a similar kind of guilty pleasure (one that makes you giggle at its own insanity)
Spermicide is homicide, the homicide of love.
The Sarge scores again!
these pro life fucks would have you believe every time you shoot a load into a tubesock you are committing a genocide.
“Pray for the people who are killing the kids of tomorrow
How desperately they need Jesus Christ in there hearts”
Funniest lyrics I have ever read.
actually these lyrics show that they actually care about people. how much hate would it take for someone to believe in God/salvation and not want people to find it also?
God isn’t real, champ.
If you wanna state that as a fact, then prove it.
Don’t need too, I have faith.
@ Beereded
There can no satisfactory proof of something that doesn’t exist if it doesn’t exist to be proven as such. Pointless argument is pointless, though it sounds like you’re messing with him…
How about I postulate that there’s a flying unicorn with 10 legs, 15 heads, and a myriad of penises of varying size. Is it real….hell no, though it would be a sight to behold. Would you disagree with me and say that it’s possible for it to exist? God is exactly the same thing, and choosing to place your faith in a figment of a collective imagination, rather than an individual’s is hypocritical at best.
If we kill all the fetuses then there won’t be enough babies to feed Dino Cazares.
HA!
win
Wow. Really? You’re bitching about a few lines of lyrics in a song from fucking 1999? Over ten whole years ago? Dude….
U MAD
HE SMASH
I’m not mad, I just think there’s cooler, more relevant shit we could be talking about. For fuck sake, these are lyrics by Dallas Taylor who isn’t even in the band anymore and hasn’t been for years now. Spencer Chamberlain isn’t half, or even a quarter as preachy as Taylor was (and still kinda is), but seriously. Dude. This post could have introduced me to an new, awesome unsigned band or reviewed a kick-ass CD. Just seems pointless to me.
Let’s just make an oath that for every girl that these Jesus freaks don’t fuck, we’ll fuck two.
Call it an Underoath?
You know what you never hear? Amish death metal. Just once, I’d like to hear some dude screaming his nuts off about overalls and really nice wood furniture.
Someone came close. Ezekial 24 (although I thought they were called Ezekial Stomp, maybe that was just the name of their demo.
Taken from another blog:
“Ezekiel 24″, the first Amish Straight Edge hardcore band. The music was fast and heavy with 3 singers screaming about killing tourists and stabbing tourists with their pitchforks. The lyrics which have been posted above had great lines like “with your camera you stole my soul, with my pitchfork Ill steal your life”.
If I’m not mistaken, the Amish are not allowed to play musical instruments. Honestly, Amish metal would prove to be more of a joke to the greater majority of the metal establishment anyways. Though, a really funny one.
@ Corey: That’s kinda what I was getting at, dude. The Amish can’t even use zippers, so electric guitars are pretty much out of the question. Although even if they had to play acoustic, the lyrics would probably be an improvement over Underoath.
@ Cryz: Going to go check out Ezekiel 24 now. Thanks!
HAHAHAHA You, sir, just made my day!
I really enjoy how fired up everybody on this site gets when it comes to religion. I am a Christian and there’s plenty of things posted on this site that I could take offense to, but I don’t. What it comes down to is that people can say whatever the hell they want to as long as you agree with it. However, if someone else disagrees with your viewpoint, then they are being ignorant and stupid. I love it how people exalt their own opinions and praise their own intelligence, but completely denounce any differing viewpoint. I know that there’s plenty of Christians who are also guilty of all of this, but I just love that the people who complain the most about it are infact, just as guilty of it.
Now I’m not trying to single you out and be a dick, and you can remove the question from a religious context if it pleases you. Is the decision to believe in something based on faith as opposed to evidence an intelligent one?
Metal is predominantly an anti-religious genre, often specifically anti-Christian. Don’t act surprised when a Metal commentary site disagrees with Christian rhetoric.
I’m not surprised by it at all. I just think there’s quite a bit of double standards when it comes to opinions.
As far as the question about embracing faith is concerned, while I can’t completely prove the existence of God, I believe there is still plenty of evidence in support of this theory. There are plenty of theories out there that are embraced by millions of people that can’t be completely proven, yet those people wouldn’t be considered ignorant or stupid for believing in them. In fact, the choice not to believe requires just as much faith as the choice to believe, because you are putting faith in your own opinions, which many times cannot be proven. What it comes down to is each person has to analyze things on their own and figure out what makes the most sense to them. I have questioned my faith since high school and continually find that it makes more sense to me than any other theory I’ve encountered.
I love that “atheism requires faith” argument, because it’s total bullshit.
It’s not though, because you can’t completely proof that God doesn’t exist. You may have some evidence supporting your unbelief, but no matter how much you may disagree with me, unbelief requires some faith simply because you have to trust that the evidence you have collected is enough evidence in support of your unbelief.
So ultimately, what you’re saying is that nothing is truly knowable.
No, no. The point is, you’re assuming that atheism is the “belief” that there is no god. Atheism means that you do not accept theistic ideals, as they are baseless. The term atheist and agnostic are nearly the same… the difference is that atheists find it UNLIKELY for a god to exist. Only fools claim an absolute.
Yeah, I think that “nothing is truly knowable” would be an accurate statement. I don’t think anyone could claim to having complete knowledge about anything really. I thinking that making such a claim is pretty egotistical and unrealistic.
i wish nate’s mom had an abortion
I would just like to ask, why does it matter if a band talks about what they believe? We bash one band but praise another, why? A simple ex. would be bands like green day or rise against. Both sing what they believe and we praise bands like them for saying what ppl are thinking. And Underoath is just saying what many christians are thinking. I like Underoath and i like what their lyrics mean, but i like suicide silence and what their lyrics mean. Not bc i agree with what they are saying, but the fact that they are saying what t they feel in their hearts. Thats what should really matter. You should not be thinking how dare they say that, but WOW they have the balls to say what they feel. Bc honestly as a society we do not say what we feel anymore bc we think we will be ridiculed for it.
Agoraphobic Nosebleed have a pro-life song and no one seemed to care about that.
i bet all 3 of their fans did
Coming from a band with an album called “Frozen corpses stuffed with dope” I’d have to assume it was sarcasm.
Personally i’m keen to extend the period at which you’re allowed to abort a child… to at least 35 years old.
I find it pretty funny that Axl first makes a big stink about religion and metal mixing, like a big cry-baby. Then he makes a pre-emptive bitch that anyone who argues that people who will disagree with him or debate politics are cry-babies.
This goes back to the crying that the movie To Die For denigrated metal heads as people who are bad, then whining because Dave Lombardo said something similer about Beavis and Butthead.
Are you too busy finding something to cry about that you don’t actually stop and take the time to think about it?
politics have no place in music. period. i’m no christian, hell i’m not even conservative, but abortion is murder, plain and simple. call me a hippie if ya like but i’d rather smoke some pot and bask in life all around me. just saying.
For something to be murder, it needs to be both illegal and involve malicious intent. “Abortion is Killing”, while still scientifically inaccurate, would be less incorrect.
Please list some bands who never make political statements.
Brokencyde, The Banana Splits, Driveshaft
That was really for “Matt,” but lulz nonetheless.
Good one.
The Monkees?
Also, for it to be murder, it hast to be a human “being.” Fetuses are human, but not human beings. They are about as human as any part of your body.
So 100% then? Also, human and human being mean the same thing in this context. Let’s consider the fetus of a dog, are you saying it is a dog but not a dog “being”?
Yes, I am. We have to have a way to differentiate between something that merely contains human DNA (I.E. an organ, fetus) and something that is actually a person. Human being is synonymous with person, NOT with human. Human means to contain DNA of the homosapien species. Human Being is to be a person like you or I.
Again, nice job failing you conservative fuck.
i really wish nate’s mom had an abortion
Matt, quit smoking and learn to read.
Metal is about politics, religion, death, drug addiction….. All the things that regular music doesn’t sing about. it’s about getting your opinion out there whatever it may be. by no means am i saying that underoath is a good band. that suck hairy sack. but my point is, this is exactly what metal is about and just because you don’t agree with it doesn’t mean it “doesn’t belong in metal”. if you took politics and religion out of metal then it’ safe to say that more then 50% of your favorite bands are ERASED.
Please list some bands who don’t make political statements.
AC/DC
Find one, I dare you.
“Rock and Roll Ain’t Noise Pollution”
Politics?? Do you listen to AC/DC?
Do me a favor and google what Bon Scott was talking about when he wrote that (and YES Bon Scott did in fact write that before he died, it was placed as a tribute to him) I promise it had ZERO to do with politics.
Grand Belial Key
The slums of jerusalem
Guess you guys don’t like Slayer’s “Silent Scream” then.
Good point… very well put sir.
Well since Underoath have taken it upon themselves to shove god down our throats, I will take thi opportunity to let Tim McTague and Co. know that when you die, thats it. No Heaven, No hell. Dirt. And if youre lucky you come back next time as jessica Alba’s thong.
And Tim Mctague looks like a homeless fucking junkie.
These guys drove out half of their audience at a show I worked in Philly a few years ago. All was well until mid-set, when the lead singer took it upon himself to preach Jesus to the crowd…for close to 10 fucking minutes. I don’t think theirs any bigger reason to NOT listen to a band then when they try to force-feed you their religious ideologies. So yeah…..on a lighter note, fuck that band. PRO-CHOICE! We’re over-populated anyway, AMMIRITE!?!
And it’s not considered “shoving it down your throat” for Satanic bands to continually denounce Christianity?
Most metal bands have some kind of stance on politics or religion and I would have to say that arguing about all of this is in itself a form of “shoving it down your throat”. The only to not “shove it down your throat” is to allow people to have their opinions and not try to convince them otherwise.
And isn’t “shoving it down your throat” inherently homo-erotic?
Is satanism an organized profitable religion as christianity is???
Are you serious? Half or more close to 3/4 of the bands showcased on MS that say they are “Satanic” are 100% full of shit. Those that really are are the corpsepaint wearing retards who worship at the altar of Varg. And I sir have no time for that trash either.
Ive NEVER heard Tom Araya, Chuck Schuldiner, Phil Anselmo, Gary Holt- or any other founding members of bands i love shove Satan down anyones throats. People make there own conceptions about these things that get out of fucking control.
And oh BTW FUCK EVERYONE OF YOU that came out of the woodworks to contribute to this purely for self gratifing purposes- and dont tell me im full of shit because ive never seen HALF of you before contribute to anything METAL related, but when Christ is in question you fucks come running and screaming from the mountain top.
Believe in what YOU want to believe. But keep it to your GODDAMNED selves.
I realize that half of these so-called satanic bands are full of shit. However, I just think it’s funny that most people on these message boards seem to be fine with any message a band has to present as long as it’s not a Christian message. Then people get all fired up and accuse the band of “shoving it down your throat.” I honestly don’t really care what kind of message a band has — I listen to bands for the music. Granted, there are certain bands I listen to for the message, I don’t get all upset about lyrics I disagree with.
I’ve never heard of satanic bands spending 10 minutes of their set trying to convince you why Satan is freedom.
They just play the fucking music. Make a few statements here and there…and once the set/theatrics are over, they leave.
Look, I’m not Christian, and I generally disagree with what Christianity stands for. That being said, I don’t have a problem with Christians, as much as I do with them shoving their ideology down our throats. All the Jerry Falwells and the Pat Robertsons and the Underoaths and everyone else who takes it upon themselves to tell me that if I don’t agree with them, I’m going to hell, needs to calm the fuck down. If you believe in something that’s fine, and if I believe in something different, that should be fine too. I’m not going to sit here on a high horse telling people what to believe and who’s right and who’s wrong. And as far as Underoath, they’re fucking terrible. They write awful songs. Even if the messages were completely agreeable I still wouldn’t buy their unlistenable crap. Whatever happened to the stand of “if you don’t like something, don’t listen to it” anyway?
+1 to all of this. I’m a Christian and yet I hate a lot of other Christians for the exact reasons you’ve listed. Jesus preached “Love Thy Neighbour,” and I don’t get how out of that, people decided to persecute others for their beliefs.
Oh, and Underoath is fucking awful. Still haven’t gotten over having to sit through that shit for 30 minutes while waiting for Machine Head at the Mayhem Fest.
You know who else is actually GOOD but sadly preaches HARDCORE during their shows? Sleeping Giant. I just saw them for the first time a few months ago, didn’t know much about them, and that really ruined them for me. In between EVERY SONG dude was talking about how Jesus is going to save all of us poor souls from Detroit, how he see’s miracles happen everyday while on the road, etc. Hey, if thats something that helps him get up everyday and make great music, then I’m ALL FOR IT, just don’t preach to me after I just paid $16 bucks to see a bunch of shit bands. I didn’t pay for Sunday service.
This makes sense to me, what Gecko said.
BTW not that anyone cares, but my issue with Underoath isn’t that they’re Christian OR that they shove down our throats (I’m fine with both), it’s that they are shitty and these lyrics are a lolfactory
I have a problem with the fact that they’re pushy about it. I would agree that the lyrical content is funnier than interracial midget pr0n.
+1 Midgets doing anything is funnier then anything you or I will do. Something about those little legs…and arms….and fingers that look like Vienna sausages….
if i see your fucking name highlighted on here one more fucking time, I will castrate you and shove your testicles down your throat
Christians to the lions. (fetuses too)
im against it. not religous not political. just i dont think its right. i wouldnt let my wife do it and if someone else does thats fine with me
do what, exactly? Have an abortion?
I will say, personally, I had my daughter at age nineteen, and while that was not exactly convenient for me, I do not regret it at all and she is a blessing to me. Later on I had my son and I was much more prepared for that. Kids are wonderful and worth the effort and heartache and the times that they may cause you to get frustrated, absolutely. If you have kids, you will most likely fall in love with them. I find myself pretty much in the pro-life category just by default, then, but I won’t preach to anyone or tell them what they should do.
yes have an abortion
You sir, are one ballsy SOB. If you’re the father, then obviously you have some say…but I don’t think there’s any way in HELL that a man should tell a woman what she can and cannot do with her body when the repercussions could affect her for the better part of a year.
@dicipleofthewatch
HOLY SHIT YOU’RE A GIRL????!!!!????
haha jk
Yes, indeed, last time I checked!
These comments are like fox news meets lambgoat.
LOL
All I know is that Christian music is a major money industry and I know for a fact that there are bands milking that industry and faking the faith. This song is so over the top silly with Jesusness that I can’t help but wonder if they are using it too.
Queue the guy that responds insulted that I would question their faithfulness.
My hunch is that Underoath meant it back then but are now just milking Jesuscore for the money
Dude, I agree with a lot of your stuff, but you’re way off on this one.
I notice everyone who is pro-chice has already been born. Just saying.
That’s why it’s called ‘pro-choice,’ not ‘pro-abortion’.
I like the band, couldn’t care less about their message. They aren’t afraid to show off their beliefs and they also aren’t dicks about it.
Regardless, this CD is pretty atrocious. The one following it was significantly better though.
I think it’s also worth mentioning that, as far as I remember, the only member of Underoath from this period that’s still in the band is Aaron.
At this time Underoath were making music for Christians. If you don’t like it, don’t listen. No one is forcing it on you. They weren’t making music with non-Christians in mind, so don’t act all offended that this song is against your beliefs. It wasn’t intended to appeal to you.
So then what was the point of putting a message for non-Christians or pro-life people on an album that was made for people that already thought and felt the way that they did? Seems like a waste of time to me.
Shouldn’t they be trying to communicate thier message to the masses that haven’t been called by God? It seems really contradictory for Christians to want to spread thier message but then say that it wasn’t meant for you when someone voices doubt about it. Since when was Christianity meant to be exclusionary?
Or did you just type that in a huff because someone was talking crap about a band you like?
It may have been in a little bit of a huff to be honest, but not because Underoath is a band I like. It’s because I am a christian and I enjoy christian metal and hardcore if it’s well executed and I hate that most christian bands are written off in the metal community due to their beliefs. I have no problem with people bashing this song because it sucks. It’s definitely not a very good song musically. My desire is for christian bands to be respected if their music demands respect. I’m not a big Underoath fan but I am a big fan of very talented bands like Living Sacrifice, Hands, Life In Your Way, etc. and I want bands like that to at least be respected as musicians, even if a good part of the metal community disagrees with their beliefs.
…so to clarify, it’s mindset that christian beliefs should not be expressed in metal music, that gets me in a huff.
LETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOULETJESUSFUCKYOU
I am so glad another person has heard of Hands. Those guys are great and I keep both of their records in constant rotation.
“…as long as any religious message isn’t too overt..” yet you, as often as possible, consistently and proudly mention that both you and Vince are Jews. Hypocrisy is rife in every religion including Judasim. You are not Jews. A Jew is a name for someone who follows the religion of Judasim. It is not a race. If you are followers of Judasim then get off your high horse and stop making comments such as this. But you probably won’t, ever if you believe in Judasim, because that’s all religions for you…..hypocritical till the end.
Oh damn. Looks like you should re-evaluate all your Jewish themed posts and specifically finding Jewish band members to interview and questions them about thier Jewishness.
I can’t believe that it took this long to get brought up
+1 Metalsucks should think before posting.
Many Jews are not religious and consider it their race and/or cultural identity. I know quite a few atheist Jews.
Few sandwiches short of a picnic are we? “Jew” does not denote race!!!!!!! Jew’s are the followers of the religion Judaism eg I’m standing next to a black guy, a white guy, and a guy from China all who are followers of Judaism….Q.which one is the Jew? A. all of them. Otherwise following your logic none of them are Jews if you believe that Jews can only have come from the middle east (where the religion stemmed).
“I know quite a few atheist Jews” – no, you know a few liars who call themselves Jews but in fact are (probably) children of parents who follow the religion of Judaism. Much like the billions of those who call themselves “Catholics” out there who have never set foot in a church, read the bible, nor acted upon Catholic valuess are in fact simply born from Catholic parents but are not automatically Catholic. Religion is a choice, not a gene.
Regardless, hypocrisy is defined in that said “Jews” have the the belief that others pushing their religious beliefs is offensive yet day after day the same thing is dribbled out of those mouths.
Lol you’re a dumbass. Read up on a topic before typing an ignorant response. That being said, I do agree with your handle…
Billy boy, my ass may be dumb but it ain’t hypocritical.
Jew != race. Accept it. Maybe you should read up on the definition of race and the definition of religion before typing an ignorant response.
But yes, agreed that all religion is fucked no matter what flavour. And most of all, all religion is hypocritical and it’s followers gullible.
This whole article is based around hypocrisy. Don’t put your views on me but I’m free to put my on you. Fuck that.
Read the dictionary; the following relevant information is contained inside:
Jew
–noun
1. one of a scattered group of people that traces its descent from the Biblical Hebrews or from postexilic adherents of Judaism; Israelite.
race
–noun
1. a group of persons related by common descent or heredity.
2. a population so related.
5. any people united by common history, language, cultural traits, etc.: the Dutch race.
The point, if I need to spell it out, is that individuals calling themselves Jews are not necessarily by definition religious (or believers in a god). These folks are not hypocritical in labeling themselves as Jewish.
It’s a tangle. Yes, you can consider the Jews a race as many Jews as they can trace back an ancestry but then again anyone can convert to the religion and not share the ancestry. So you’re both right, there are racial Jews and religious Jews.
Since the Supreme Court deems them a race I wonder if, by law, a converted Jew can be legaly viewed as racial Jew as well.
Regardless, the Germans saw them as a race and let’s face it, they were pretty meticulous when writing thier Blood and Honor laws with all thier degrees of mixed blood.
I can’t be arsed arguing. Jew != race. End of.
ASSuming Jew is classed as race and have no religious meaning in this particular context, then there’d be no issue with those calling themselves said race when commenting. But the fact remains that EVERY time Jew is mentioned on here it IS in a religious context – 8 Nights of Heavy Metal Hanukkah (or is that now not a religous festival?) ring any bells? Hence the term is used with a religious context not just a race context…….“as long as any religious message isn’t too overt”…..hypocrisy.
ps as race=religion (in some eyes) I’m converting from agnostic to Negroid (I hear God gives you a huge cock)……or maybe Malayan (I’ll make a dynamite laksa)
politics have no place in metal
But apparently they do on a website about metal.
quote mining cunt. I’m not one to defend axl, but that is NOT what he said. You’re fucking trash.
I agree with most of the points you’ve made thus far…but the insults aren’t helping at all.
Quote mining is a deplorable practice and deserves nothing less than the most brutal of diatribes in response.
Wait, she’s from that country famous for producing kiwi fruit. Where was that again Axl? That’s right, the Ukraine!
you better pray to whatever the fuck you pray to that i dont fucking find you
Then quit goddamn the politics!!
ooooh I need to sopt after three cups of coffee………
Ya so STFU.
Oh damn. Looks like you should re-evaluate all your Jewish themed posts and specifically finding Jewish band members to interview and questions them about thier Jewishness.
I can’t believe that it took this long to get brought up.
Don’t get me started, they killed our lord! Although to be fair we should probably also be angry at the Italians for their part in it…
Still, Living Sacrifice have a new album out soon.
I hope you’re being sarcastic.
About having any sort of religious “beef” with Jewish people, either by birth or conversion, yes, very sarcastic…
About being angry at the Italians… less so, but they know why… *shakes fist*
About Living Sacrifice. Not at all.
Ok, good. Anti-semitism from a christian standpoint is retarded — you know, that whole jesus being a jew thing.
And magic. Don’t forget magic.
I’ll go on the record as saying that if a fetus can survive outside the womb on its own, it is then a human being and should not be aborted. If it cannot, than it is still a part of the woman’s body.
As for religious people: There’s no Easter Bunny, there’s no Santa Claus, but there’s a God? Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. It’d be nice to think there’s something out there for us after we die, so I get the desire to believe, but athiests should also not be treated the way they are by most religious people.
I agree with the thought that as long as a band’s lyrics aren’t too preachy, I don’t care if I agree or disagree with their beliefs. I like Zao, Living Sacrifice, Soul Embraced, etc. but that doesn’t make me a ‘believer’.
As for Underoath, they have always sucked.
I agree with all your points. Except for the bands you like. Living Sacrifice is the only one worth a listen to, and they get very boring after awhile.
Ehhh. I was mainly pointing out that I don’t care about the lyrical content that much, and am okay with some Christian metal. Zao’s new album isn’t very good, but ‘The Funeral of God’ is awesome. And Soul Embraced – ‘Immune’ is a great album to drive really fast to.
Every sperm is sacred. Every sperm is great. If a sperm is wasted, God gets quite irate!
Freedom of speech as long as that speech falls in line with your opinions, right guys? I can’t believe this shit. They don’t hold the same beliefs as you so it rubs you the wrong way. Well, I’m sure your beliefs would rub them the wrong way too. Why does it have to turn into an “us vs. them” situation?
Also, as has been pointed out, this is incredibly ironic considering all the Jew praise on this site. Sure, some Jews may consider themselves a race rather than religion, guess what, unless those people are Israeli and are talking about, by proxy, that fact, they’re wrong. Jewish is not a race. My dad’s converted from Judaism and, guess what, you can’t convert your race.
You fuckers are so hypocritical it’s not even funny. My “peers in the metal community” piss me off so much with all the closed minded bullshit that I see spewed.
I agree. This is what I’ve been trying to get through to people with a few of my comments. While I disagree with much of the viewpoints on this site, I don’t start trash talking every time I take slight offense to something. Double standards, people, double standards.
I think the main point of this was to make fun of Underoath’s crappy music, and uninspired lyrics. System of a Down and Rage Against the Machine at least have a poetry to what they sing about.
Does anyone actually like underoath anyway? Hell their website is underoath777.com…..wtf……
One can be pro-choice and still think you’re a dumbass for not realizing the consequences of having unprotected sex. And yes, you shoulda thought of it before having sex. Being pro-choice and wishing abortion wasn’t a necessary procedure are not mutually exclusive ideals.
a good thing that came out of this band was maylene and the sons of disaster
So where do we stand?
Underoath sucks. God isn’t real. And Catholics Come Home Commercials are just a scam?
Sweet. Life is just as good as it was yesterday.
“Underoath sucks. God isn’t real.”
WIN
So does this mean Sepultura’s “Dead Embryonic Cells” also rubs you the wrong way?
“I was adopted b christian pro-life parents when I was a child!” BANG BANG
“Does my penis make me a bad boy?” BANG
“Uhhhh …. Where’s the tower, where’s the gun? Where’s the tower, where’s the gun?”
“Please, give me the Satan worshiping family down the block. You know, the one with the good albums.”
I miss Krishna hardcore bands. Where’s Ray Cappo when you need him?
Drinking wine with dinner in Italy
HAY-O!
Haha, I remember whan that happened. It caused such a shit storm with all the little straight edge kids.
There’s a long -standing punk band from Cleveland called Hostile Omish. They churn butter onstage.
God I haven’t heard that name in FOREVER. They are brilliant!
Any mention of abortion always brings out the frothing, slogan-vomiting morons. Usually there are more uneducated “pro-life” nitwits to balance out the uneducated sociopaths on the *other side* like Nate, though.
I’m an uneducated sociopath now? Sweet. I guess actually, y’know, studying something makes you an idiot.
oh my fucking holy deity. You are one sorry son of a bitch who was probably sodomized as a child
I am one of many people who get rubbed the wrong way by Christianity. Underoath is not the kind of voice people want to hear talking about pro-life. If Varg Vikernes promoted being pro-life, I am sure sure that some of the spineless idiots out there would suddenly support it being pro-life, just as if Varg said to jump off a cliff. I am pro-life, but not because Underoath or some celebrity made a commencial telling me. Children who aren’t wanted can be adopted out to one of the many families who want a child.
Unfortunately that’s not how it works. Although of course it should. Personally I am all in favour of adopting rather than bringing yet another person into an already over-populated world. We need to take care of the ones who already exist, rather than inflict the horrors of existence on someone else (and let’s just think… puberty is pretty horrifying, right?).
And I am neither pro-life nor pro-choice… I’m not american so feel no need to ascribe myself a specific title and thereby limit myself. To be honest I’m not entirely certain there really is any reason to sanctify human life at all, other than to maintain the social contract.
And black metal flows through my veins and I still think Varg is a tool.
Good post!
Underoath should of have been aborted.
Its shit like this that makes me wish that none of these religions could exist.
We need another Nero to thin out their ranks a little…
Why do those of us who are Christians have to be so brutally misrepresented? Between these guys and the 700 Club shit about Haiti, I’ve had more than enough of my fill of self-righteous “Christian” assholes. Last I checked, Christians were supposed to be friendly people that forgave people’s sins.
ok. I happen to be an 18yr old college student. My mother had me when she was 18 and my father was 19. I feel abortions are wrong because all any child needs is love. If you dont want to keep the child, why kill it? There are thousands upon thousands of families in our country that cannot have children who would die to have one. My parents chose to keep me because my mother and father felt that it was their responsibility to raise me and to make me the best person i can be. I can almost garauntee that any pro-choice person will change their minds if they have a child before marriage. Children are our future. WHy would you destroy your future? And yes I believe that life begins at conception. That fetus a lot of people seem so set to kill would one day pay for your social security. Why would you kill them? Hell, dont kill them, kill their future wallets
and to that Nate fuckhead.
People like you are the people that make me believe that there really is a god. You wanna know why? Because you are so set on proving there isnt one. To each man his own faith bud, why would you put it down or change it? And i bid you farewell with a huge-ass FUCK YOU, YOU FUCKING COCKFUCK
Pulling out isn’t metal.
Ive been scrolling through the comments, Has anyone made a Dying Fetus Joke yet? I have not seen one. I mean, I get the heated arguments, but a Dying Fetus joke would be a wasted opportunity. Sadly, I am not clever.
That was the first thing that came to mind for me, or maybe an Aborted joke…