Comments on: TRAP THEM’S RYAN MCKENNEY RESPONDS TO SACHA DUNABLE’S METALSUCKS COLUMN

By: Marc Lamoureux

Marc Lamoureux — Tue, 15 Nov 2011 13:57:00 +0000

Ryan. Never heard of you guys before but after your reading your post I went and checked out your material. Consider me a new fan. And I did what I do and went and bought two of your t-shirts.

By: Nick Reppucci

Nick Reppucci — Mon, 14 Nov 2011 06:43:00 +0000

I. LOVE. THIS. I dropped 35 bucks to see Asking Alexandria, We Came As
Romans, DRUGS, and more tonight. And I was more than thoroughly
satisfied. And it’s true, I would be broke in three weeks if I kept it
up, but that’s where priorities come into play. I’m a music major and
starting a band of my own. It would be great to play for people and not
worry about starving to death every other week.

By: Jay Leno

Jay Leno — Sun, 13 Nov 2011 23:10:00 +0000

people need to stop being so fucking frugal with their money in general. I’ve dropped $50 to see A7X, multiple times (and before I get flamed, I would do the same for any band I care about. you know, loomis-era nevermore, symphony x, lamb of god, children of bodom, animals as leaders, devin townsend, iron maiden, whatever. probably even metallica if there was assurance I would not hear anything from load, reload, or st. anger). It is really retarded to think that people complain about paying like $15 for a show. That is fucking stupid. If you cannot afford it, fine, do not go. But do not bitch and say it is expensive, it is far from it. I’m paying $25 to see BtBaM and AAL next week, and I plan on buying merch. Am I loaded? Fuck no. I’m a poor college kid. I just support what I believe in, and when I finally end up on tour I damn well expect people to do the same. If not? Fuck you, I’ll have my drummer ram his stick up your ass mid set.

By: Hannah Knapp

Hannah Knapp — Tue, 28 Jun 2011 22:45:09 +0000

THIS. So hard. Protools and macs and so forth are extremely expensive. Cut out the software and use garageband? Or another “cheaper program”? Macs cost a fucking fortune. Microphones cost a fortune. A decent set of drum mics will probably run over $300.

Not to mention the hours it takes to make a recording sound good.

By: Person

Person — Mon, 11 Apr 2011 01:26:34 +0000

I think this column has a lot of valid points but what really irks me is the attitude that “we are more punk and more entitled than you since we didn’t go to school, we are poor, and this is the only thing we do for a living.” Basically pass us more money. Also the stereotype of people that don’t fit your mold is ridiculous. I agree with the person above me, if you want to figure out some of your cash problems, then maybe you should go back to school, find a job, etc.
Playing music is a dream job. Just like sports some people make it and most don’t. The problem now a days is that people have so many different options now because of technology, that as an individual I can go online, find a band that is in the middle of nowhere and dig their music through their webpage. The real problem is the music industry has been saturated. We are treading new waters since a lot more bands go on tour now than ever before and we are exposed to so much more. More money is spread amongst a wider amount of musicians. The line between “making it” and not has been grayed.
I have no problem with the fact that some bands might accept corporate sponsors and I think it is a reality that most band will not get paid well doing this as a living. It just irks me that you chose this profession and then go on to complain about the lifestyle you live. Hell, I would go on tour full time if I knew I could make really great money doing it because I love playing music but the reality is, you are taking a chance with the profession. I’m sorry if I am not as punk rock since I went to college and went on “vacation” touring when I could. I just have different priorities.
You have great points, go corporate for all I care, punk/hardcore/metal shows should be a little more when decent sized touring bands come in and they usually are here in California. I just think your mentality about it is wrong.

By: mar

mar — Mon, 11 Apr 2011 00:29:16 +0000

AGREED!!!! rayray………….. is a jackass.

By: Nick

Nick — Sun, 10 Apr 2011 19:08:50 +0000

i remember how awesome it was to hear that Annihilation Time broke up. why? because Jimmy didn’t want to take corporate sponsorship and the rest of the band did. good for him, and good for the rest of them because Lecherous Gaze plays the corporate shit and Jimmy’s new band Ratface doesn’t. if you don’t like corporate sponsorship don’t support it! is this really that hard? if you don’t like the programme get up turn off the set!!!!

By: Mario Buda

Mario Buda — Fri, 08 Apr 2011 02:21:17 +0000

Y’all should try leaving the internet sometime and joining (or forming) your local, vibrant, DIY scene. You’ll be around a lot less money, but life will be so much fuller. I’ve been broke for as long as I can remember — and it got old a long time ago — but I’ve had so many amazing experiences that money (or people who care so much about getting paid) had nothing to do with. This budding rock star says he wants to leave punk behind. I say don’t let the door hit him on his way out. We’ll do just fine without him.

By: JM Hell

JM Hell — Fri, 14 Jan 2011 04:55:39 +0000

Thanks. Someone who fucking gets it. DIY. Sponsored gigs are the antithesis of that ethic, and that the amount of people who’ve abandoned it so readily speaks very poorly for a scene I’ve devoted the better part of my life to.

By: JM Hell

JM Hell — Fri, 14 Jan 2011 04:43:05 +0000

The ass kissing is off the fucking charts here.

Here’s the deal: You can up your prices, stick to your principles and charge what you feel you deserve. The two most important rules in contracting? Demand top dollar and guarantee everything you do. If you’re worth it, charge it. Simples.

But here we’re presented with a false dilemma; this guy would have you believe that the only options for touring musicians is to cut costs, take a huge loss and starve, or accept corporate sponsorship. Corporate sponsorships. Let that sink in, for a second. There are apparently no alternatives, no other way to subsidize their music, but this is horseshit. If it’s such a big deal, then put in the graft and get your trade, get your degree. Subsidize your music in other ways. Negotiate better record contracts, learn how to engineer your own albums. Godcity has cachet, but I’m sure a killer record can be recorded without having to shell out a few grand and drive to Massachusets.

The fact is that corporate gigs in punk and hardcore is the fucking definition of selling out, and if you don’t think that the current level of fan devotion is high enough, you can fuck yourself. You won’t be seeing this guy at any of that shit, but all the best anyway.

By: mikey

mikey — Tue, 11 Jan 2011 09:50:38 +0000

no one gets rich driving around in a van playing music…these fuckin kids put their hearts out there…the least they can get is compensation for their time and expenses. i’m not gonna lie…i download a shitload of music and i appreciate getting on some door list and seeing a free show….and yes it does piss me off when bands i love go on tour with some big stupid fuckin band i dont wanna see for 45 bucks a ticket…or some Dethclok gimmick freakshow…….but it’s soooo important to try and give back whatever you can to something you love. you gotta support art or it goes away…ive seen alot of bands crash and burn because of financial problems and touring stresses. buy the record if you can….if you download the music then at least pay for the shows when the bands come around…and if its a free show and you already have the music but a tshirt or some shit. i live in relative poverty so i usually dont have alot of dough…but i’ll still go watch a band i love and throw a few bucks at them evn if i have all the music…its like HERE!! THANK YOU FOR LEAVING YOUR WHOLE LIFE BEHIND TO DRIVE FOR WEEKS JUST TO PLAY MUSIC I LOVE RIGHT HERE IN MY HOME TOWN!! thanks…heres a few dollars….support touring bands…support local shows in any way you can. no ones saying pay 50 bucks to see a band…and i sure as fuck wont be buying any 40 dollar Terror hoogies, but at least show your support and help out with a 5 dollar ep here and a 10 dollar tshirt here. as far as” punk rock”…fuck the politics…its not ALL about money, but it is at least a little about money…you gotta grease the wheel…do your part.

By: Derek

Derek — Fri, 24 Sep 2010 01:49:20 +0000

it’s not a clean cut black and white scenario here. i think everyone can agree that door prices have only gone up a fraction of what inflation has since the inception of DIY hardcore, punk and metal shows, and charging more at the door would reflect the real costs and work that goes in to putting on a show. the truth is, (speaking in terms of hardcore, what i know) hardcore will never make money. whether you are a band or a promoter, if you are adhering to real DIY ethics (keeping punk out of the music industry) over all, breaking even would be a lucky feat, ESPECIALLY in smaller towns, and poorer countries that do not have numbers.

I have played many shows in small towns, and poor countries like el salvador, guatemala, ukraine, russia, poland etc. and I think there is an importance and urgent need to play in these places where absolutely no money is to be made. these are the kids who need this music more than anyone, and some of the most amazing and inspiring shows i have played have been in these countries.

there is always talk about bands getting what they deserve, how touring is expensive, and bands need that door money to survive, and sometimes even concerns about the promoters (having to pay out of pocket etc.). Lets be honest though, going on tour is a glorified vacation. if your band doesn’t draw enough people at $10 a head to get you to the next town, you either need to cut back on the hotel rooms and other unnecessary costs, or start playing a different type of music. if your band draws enough people to pay for everything plus some hotel rooms, beer, twinkies, whatever, then hey, good for you. But just because you started a band and booked 12 shows across the country on myspace doesn’t mean the hardcore punk world owes you anything.

I’m not knocking starting a band and doing just that, i think that is awesome, as long as you are willing to accept that it’s not going to be easy or financially smart. If you aren’t willing to suffer a little bit though, maybe you should just stop.

These days the line between DIY and the music industry is very blurred, with hardcore labels having bands sign contracts, booking agencies having promoters sign contracts with guarantees, i’ve seen a lot of bands disappointed with tours and bummed about losing money, and frustrated that no one comes to their shows, it’s like they expect to have everything handed to them. when we tell people we booked our own tours in europe they are like “whaaaat?” when we tell them we drove ourselves they are like “whaaaaaaat?” when we tell them we don’t come home with pockets full of money they have the same reaction. but there is a definite satisfaction and fulfillment that comes with doing something yourself, whether it is profitable or not.

to relate all this back to the article. no i wouldn’t pay 30 bucks to go to the imax. no i wouldn’t pay 150 bucks to see lady gaga, or go to opening day, or a comedian, or some “flavor of the week hip hop artist”, no, i would not. just like i wouldn’t spend $300 on the newest version of the iphone or whatever, or buy a new car blah blah etc. i know most people would, most of you would. i’m not going to say there is anything wrong with that, but really, that IS mainstream. i consider myself part of something that isn’t, and i don’t think hardcore and punk should be compared to mainstream norms. if you want to start a band and get a corporate sponsorship, cool, i am not impressed, but i’m not going to dislike you for it.

What it comes down to is people talking about “extreme music” like it’s all the same. just because you play loud or fast or sound a certain way doesn’t mean you are a hardcore band. there has always been more to this genre than that, some bands have it, some don’t. on the same note, if you want change, DO IT YOURSELF.

By: JADEDKID

JADEDKID — Tue, 21 Sep 2010 20:20:19 +0000

Yes, go to less shows. pay more for bands you really care about. that’ll take care of a lot of over-saturation and those last minute/garbage bands.

By: Francisco Boni Neto

Francisco Boni Neto — Mon, 20 Sep 2010 08:56:14 +0000

I pay for bands and music that deserves to survive (free market), not because they ‘own’ bits of information (you can’t own electrons). And I expect people to do the same, I would never complain about not being paid for electrons or digital music. That is just retarded and dumb.

By: Francisco Boni Neto

Francisco Boni Neto — Mon, 20 Sep 2010 08:51:15 +0000

1) Get some education.
2) GET A REAL JOB.
3) Stop trying to be a musician. Stop being a Neo-Luddite. Music, as a profession, is by chance, just a dream and not a job.
4) ???
5) PROFIT!!!!!!!

By: Craig S A Raymond

Craig S A Raymond — Sun, 05 Sep 2010 19:19:38 +0000

This is one of the best write-ups I’ve seen in a long time, and as the writer said, I’m also not one for reading long winded things, but this was definately worth the read, adn as a musician myself, I’m totally agree with the whining patrons for ticket prices, and hope to heaven’s sake that when it’s my turn, I can be properly paid for my services as a musician.

By: Andy

Andy — Wed, 01 Sep 2010 15:25:54 +0000

$10? I bought tickets to see Rush for $45, and the fees were $18 a ticket, jacking the price up over $60. Almost $60 for someone to print them out and put them in an envelope.

By: Luna

Luna — Wed, 01 Sep 2010 11:31:49 +0000

Ethics and such are grand concepts. Punx or punks makes no difference. We live in the USA. A market economy the functions with-in the frame work of Capitalism. The first rule of economics is supply and demand. There is just a large supply of Hardcore (or any) bands and limited supply of fans. The issue is volume of sales not price of goods sold. The profit margin required to run a show of any size other than a basement show, requires a certain price point to cover fixed expenses. The workers need to be paid as well as the bands and all the other people involved in the production. The whole endeavor becomes more lucrative as the volume of sales increases. (fixed cost are covered) Yes the Bands are the draw , but they will only earn what the market will be willing to pay and thus the volume of sales they are capable of generating. The said band my not like that fact, but it is their decision to choose the said career. We all suffer the consequences of our life and career choices. If you choose to be a starving artist then so be it. Otherwise quit bitching and look at your alternatives.

By: Scuba

Scuba — Wed, 01 Sep 2010 00:44:56 +0000

and where exactly did you hear this?

because i can’t wait to quit my job and stop eating bread sandwiches and live off of said “huge advance.”

By: Spoiled

Spoiled — Tue, 31 Aug 2010 20:40:59 +0000

thats all well and good. money is money. trap them got a huge advance from their label so i dont think they are hurting to much.